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Gaming Stuff => Political Games => Topic started by: Calandale on July 15, 2014, 03:11:02 am



Title: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: Calandale on July 15, 2014, 03:11:02 am
Stuff like Republic of Rome or Junta. Even in Kingmaker, my favorite part was the
advanced parliament. I'm also big on election games like Road to the White House.


Just dropped too much money on a copy of the less known Founding Fathers game today.


Title: Re: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: kira1y on July 15, 2014, 07:32:35 am
Have you ever tried Die Macher?


Title: Re: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: usrlocal on July 15, 2014, 09:53:05 am
If you like political interactions, 'Triumph of Chaos' is worth the trouble, IMHO. HerrDr has done a nice job of bolting a political system onto a PoG template. Works really well.


Title: Re: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: Calandale on July 15, 2014, 09:56:29 am
Have you ever tried Die Macher?

Yes. I didn't get much out of it. There were aspects that felt unbelievable to me,
and German players seemed to agree that it wasn't representative of actual politics.
A lot of fiddling about with little payoff.


Title: Re: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: Calandale on July 15, 2014, 09:57:02 am
If you like political interactions, 'Triumph of Chaos' is worth the trouble, IMHO. HerrDr has done a nice job of bolting a political system onto a PoG template. Works really well.

I know I had hell with the game, but I have no recollection of much political interplay.


Title: Re: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: Sluggonics on July 15, 2014, 10:08:47 am
Stuff like Republic of Rome or Junta. Even in Kingmaker, my favorite part was the
advanced parliament. I'm also big on election games like Road to the White House.


Just dropped too much money on a copy of the less known Founding Fathers game today.

I rather enjoyed the Parliament and bidding for offices in Crown of Roses.  I only ever played the PC version of Kingmaker, so I don't remember how Parliament worked there, but it was probably pretty similar to Crown of Roses, since the designer of that game indicated that his initial goal was to remake Kingmaker.  It ended up turning into something much more involved, though.


Title: Re: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: Calandale on July 15, 2014, 10:10:01 am
Stuff like Republic of Rome or Junta. Even in Kingmaker, my favorite part was the
advanced parliament. I'm also big on election games like Road to the White House.


Just dropped too much money on a copy of the less known Founding Fathers game today.

I rather enjoyed the Parliament and bidding for offices in Crown of Roses.  I only ever played the PC version of Kingmaker, so I don't remember how Parliament worked there, but it was probably pretty similar to Crown of Roses, since the designer of that game indicated that his initial goal was to remake Kingmaker.  It ended up turning into something much more involved, though.

One of a couple games I really wish hadn't been made with blocks.


Title: Re: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: usrlocal on July 15, 2014, 10:31:30 am
If you like political interactions, 'Triumph of Chaos' is worth the trouble, IMHO. HerrDr has done a nice job of bolting a political system onto a PoG template. Works really well.

I know I had hell with the game, but I have no recollection of much political interplay.

Oh yeah! There's even a snazzy political factions influence grid!


Title: Re: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: stemcider on July 15, 2014, 02:30:50 pm
I've always wanted to play Diplomacy.


Title: Re: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: anarchy on July 15, 2014, 02:35:29 pm
I've always wanted to play Diplomacy.
Not that I've played Dip much, but it's never gone well.

FFG's Warrior Knights has some good political rules plus it's a solid multiplayer wargame.


Title: Re: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: Calandale on July 15, 2014, 02:41:59 pm
I've always wanted to play Diplomacy.
Not that I've played Dip much, but it's never gone well.

I've enjoyed it F2F. Online sucked for me.

Quote
FFG's Warrior Knights has some good political rules plus it's a solid multiplayer wargame.

Definite improvement on the original, I think.


Title: Re: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: KevinR on July 15, 2014, 02:46:24 pm
I've always wanted to play Diplomacy.

Isn't that a military game?   :P

I played a lot of PBeM Diplomacy in the 1990s, but drifted away since.


Title: Re: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: Calandale on July 15, 2014, 02:51:45 pm
I've always wanted to play Diplomacy.

Isn't that a military game?   :P



Dunno WHAT to classify it as. It's so wrong as any kind of simulation that I can't tell
what it's meant to represent. I guess the terms 'armies' and 'fleets' might be a clue though.


Title: Re: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: stemcider on July 15, 2014, 02:58:03 pm
I've always wanted to play Diplomacy.

Isn't that a military game?   :P



Dunno WHAT to classify it as. It's so wrong as any kind of simulation that I can't tell
what it's meant to represent. I guess the terms 'armies' and 'fleets' might be a clue though.

From what I can tell, its a negotiation game at heart. Which I think would fall into the political category.


Title: Re: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: Calandale on July 15, 2014, 03:31:30 pm
I've always wanted to play Diplomacy.

Isn't that a military game?   :P



Dunno WHAT to classify it as. It's so wrong as any kind of simulation that I can't tell
what it's meant to represent. I guess the terms 'armies' and 'fleets' might be a clue though.

From what I can tell, its a negotiation game at heart. Which I think would fall into the political category.

But that's the mechanism. I wouldn't say all negotiation based games are about politics.

Think about a price-fixing game.


Title: Re: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: stemcider on July 15, 2014, 03:51:18 pm
I've always wanted to play Diplomacy.

Isn't that a military game?   :P



Dunno WHAT to classify it as. It's so wrong as any kind of simulation that I can't tell
what it's meant to represent. I guess the terms 'armies' and 'fleets' might be a clue though.

From what I can tell, its a negotiation game at heart. Which I think would fall into the political category.

But that's the mechanism. I wouldn't say all negotiation based games are about politics.

Think about a price-fixing game.

True. Or even Settlers of Catan.

Does Negotiation mechanism + Military setting = political?


Title: Re: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: SilentDibs on July 15, 2014, 07:42:55 pm
Does Negotiation mechanism + Military setting = political?
Nope. Cataclysm (my design to be published by GMT) is a political game as much as it is a military one, but there's almost no negotiation in it.


Title: Re: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: Kreator82 on July 16, 2014, 04:24:21 am
I haven't played them, but I have heard great things about Founding Fathers, and Die Macher. Isn't Founding Fathers designed by the same guy that did Twilight Struggle?


Title: Re: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: Calandale on July 16, 2014, 04:43:17 am
Yeah. FF is okay. It doesn't really do a good job of representing things.
DM disappointed me heavily. It wasn't connected well at all.

I just ordered the OTHER Founding Fathers (by Rick Heli). Have high hopes
for that one, as it's based upon Republic of Rome, but without being military
centered.


Title: Re: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: Hegel on July 22, 2014, 11:14:01 am
A game I'd like to recommend is Sigismundus Augustus. Basically a heavy worker placement game but very cutthroat. And the theme (Polish in the 15th century) works very well.


Title: Re: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: anarchy on July 22, 2014, 01:31:37 pm
Don't laugh, but the Vampire: The Eternal Struggle CCG had a wonderful political system. It shined best in 4-5 player games. There were decks built around politics and controlling the game outside of combat. Political cards could be played that required everyone to vote and certain characters had more votes than others. Combat decks would have to assassinate politicians or they could find themselves shut down.


Title: Re: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: kira1y on July 22, 2014, 01:33:39 pm
Don't laugh, but the Vampire: The Eternal Struggle CCG had a wonderful political system. It shined best in 4-5 player games. There were decks built around politics and controlling the game outside of combat. Political cards could be played that required everyone to vote and certain characters had more votes than others. Combat decks would have to assassinate politicians or they could find themselves shut down.

Is this the one that was originally called Jyhad? We have all of the first edition cards of that stored some damned place in the house. Awesome game!


Title: Re: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: anarchy on July 22, 2014, 01:43:03 pm
Don't laugh, but the Vampire: The Eternal Struggle CCG had a wonderful political system. It shined best in 4-5 player games. There were decks built around politics and controlling the game outside of combat. Political cards could be played that required everyone to vote and certain characters had more votes than others. Combat decks would have to assassinate politicians or they could find themselves shut down.

Is this the one that was originally called Jyhad? We have all of the first edition cards of that stored some damned place in the house. Awesome game!

Yep, that was it. I forgot they changed the name at some point.

I think it's the best 3+ player CCG out there. And mostly because of the politics.


Title: Re: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: Calandale on July 22, 2014, 02:32:53 pm
I remember watching it played. Didn't want to get into another CCG (I was big into M:tG),
but I think I've picked up some Jyhad cards more recently.


Title: Re: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: anarchy on July 22, 2014, 03:16:06 pm
I had about 1,000 cards, but I gave them to some neighborhood kids a few years ago.


Title: Re: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: usrlocal on July 22, 2014, 05:53:35 pm

I think it's the best 3+ player CCG out there. And mostly because of the politics.

That would be Shadowfist, but s/'politics'/'ass-kicking'.


Title: Re: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: usrlocal on July 22, 2014, 05:54:39 pm
Seriously, though, I've heard great things about Jyhad.

Too bad my house is already full of other dead CCGs.


Title: Re: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: stemcider on July 22, 2014, 05:58:24 pm
Does Tammany Hall have elections?


Title: Re: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: Calandale on July 22, 2014, 06:09:07 pm
Does Tammany Hall have elections?

Yes. It doesn't feel like much in the way of simulation, but it's a pretty good game.

Watching the population distributions arise is probably my favorite part.


Title: Re: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: anarchy on July 22, 2014, 07:17:59 pm

I think it's the best 3+ player CCG out there. And mostly because of the politics.

That would be Shadowfist, but s/'politics'/'ass-kicking'.

I've never played Shadowfist, so I'll give you the benefit of the doubt...


Title: Re: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: usrlocal on July 22, 2014, 07:22:28 pm

I think it's the best 3+ player CCG out there. And mostly because of the politics.

That would be Shadowfist, but s/'politics'/'ass-kicking'.

I've never played Shadowfist, so I'll give you the benefit of the doubt...

Well, I never played Jyhad, either. But now you have me interested.   :)


Title: Re: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: Rosebluepaint on July 23, 2014, 06:49:12 am
I have just played the other Founding Fathers (Rick Heli's game).  I have not played Republic of Rome (and by the way he does an 'Expansion'/Alternate version of that - Republic of Carthage, playable standalone or in combination, though you do need RoR for some of the components).
I play group solo like Calendale.  Each player fields Statesmen who vie to become President whereupon they attempt to resolve 4 Issues, perhaps passing them to a Cabinet appointed statesman or haveing to go through Congressional votes.
Earning cabinet or Presidential/Vice-P. roles garners 'Popularity', as does resolving Issues, and the sum of all your Staesmen's earned popularity determines the winner at the end.
The Pres./Vice-Pres. voting mechanism is a simple placement  of cubes upon succesively adjacent States to your starting state revolving around blocking your oppents due to the limited vacancy-for-cubes per state.

I have only played it once so far, I enjoyed it and can see that it would require alot of plays or intense analysis each turn to determine how to flow it.
In my game one Presidential hopeful, a Party Leader most of the game due to high popularity, could never win the Presidency because he starts in New England and opponents always blocked his campaigning from breaking out into the Mid-East and South by blocking New York of Pennsylvania.  He was buying newspapers furiously at the end in order to push public support over to his party thus favouring turn order for selection of running mate and campaign cube positioning.  Alas, the leading player recklessly ruined the economy resulting in a sudden death game end on a (un)lucky roll.  The third deck of Issues had not been entered.  Of course the other players should have allowed in more taxes and tariffs to boost the revenues so as to stop this, but when they had Presidents they didn't do so.

For a first learning game it was great.  I would be really interested in seeing any Calendale video on this, or any reports from others.

Apparently Rick intended to keep the spirit of RoR but smoothen or simplify out some fiddliness.

How do RoR, etc. compare to the COIN games?  In this FF the player kind of represents some abstract skill at statemanship, for the victor is determined by the overall best at that, measuring it in terms of 'Popularity'. Each player fields statesmen from competing parties, whilst in COIN each player is one definable faction. Yet in both I believe cooperation is very important and necessary. In this you are trying to keep everything afloat together whilst creaming off the best of it.  In COIN is there the danger of it all folding unless you cooperate, or are you only only using each other temporarily in order to get off the better in the bargain?

Rosebluepaint (Agip on BGG)


Title: Re: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: Calandale on July 23, 2014, 08:57:33 am
RoR feels much more like it tells a story to me than COIN does. There is limited cooperation between
SOME COIN factions, but you're never fighting against the system itself; there is no shared baby in
COIN.

Should be getting FF by the end of the month.


Title: Re: Political interactions are among my favorite designs
Post by: Calandale on July 27, 2014, 05:50:05 am
New thread: http://thegamebox.gamesontables.com/index.php?topic=35.0