The Game Box

Gaming Stuff => Economic Games => Topic started by: manhattandoctor on July 16, 2014, 07:22:02 pm



Title: 18xx for newbies
Post by: manhattandoctor on July 16, 2014, 07:22:02 pm
I've played a bit of 1830. I own 1856, 1860, 18AL, and 1830. I have two willing newbs. Where would you start them?


Title: Re: 18xx for newbies
Post by: Calandale on July 16, 2014, 07:40:32 pm
How much do they like things harsh?

The 1830 short game is the way I got hooked, because of how intense the pressure is.
The full '30 is pretty good to begin with too, but it's a longer investment; less harsh though -
people have time to build more. 18AL is a slightly more forgiving version of '30.

'56 is more complex, yet very harsh. It's perhaps my favorite in the series, but not a great
starting game. The loans add a layer of decisions that can really turn people off.

Haven't played '60 yet. I hear it's a good intro though.


Title: Re: 18xx for newbies
Post by: kira1y on July 16, 2014, 07:42:53 pm
'56 is more complex, yet very harsh. It's perhaps my favorite in the series, but not a great starting game. The loans add a layer of decisions that can really turn people off.
1856 was my intro. First time ever playing an 18XX game and it went on for like eight hours. I haven't looked at an 18XX games since (although I would like to at some point).


Title: Re: 18xx for newbies
Post by: Calandale on July 16, 2014, 09:59:45 pm
Most of our '56 games lasted under 4 hours. People seemed unable to avoid bankruptcy.


Title: Re: 18xx for newbies
Post by: kira1y on July 17, 2014, 06:36:50 am
Most of our '56 games lasted under 4 hours. People seemed unable to avoid bankruptcy.

I'm fairly certain we were doing something wrong, just never bothered to figure out what it was...


Title: Re: 18xx for newbies
Post by: Calandale on July 17, 2014, 10:57:21 am
Perhaps not. If people are really cautious, these games can be long.


Title: Re: 18xx for newbies
Post by: anarchy on July 17, 2014, 12:53:23 pm
Poseidon is 18xx with the theme filed off and plays in a reasonable two hours, but I understand most 18xx players find it dull.

This discussion made me pull it down off the shelf and set it up for a solo play.


Title: Re: 18xx for newbies
Post by: Calandale on July 17, 2014, 01:01:22 pm
For a not-quite 'xx, that captures the spirit well (IMO) without as much effort,
I'd suggest Baltimore & Ohio.


Title: Re: 18xx for newbies
Post by: anarchy on July 17, 2014, 01:07:56 pm
For a not-quite 'xx, that captures the spirit well (IMO) without as much effort,
I'd suggest Baltimore & Ohio.
Thanks for the suggestion.

*runs off to check BGG*

But... Eagle Games and Winsome Games. Yeah, can't do that. Burned by Eagle Games customer service too many times and Winsome Games is a jerk.

Thanks, tho.


Title: Re: 18xx for newbies
Post by: Calandale on July 17, 2014, 01:10:47 pm
Heh. Pity. Winsome has a lot of lighter games that catch a bit of the 'xx flavor without the commitment.


Title: Re: 18xx for newbies
Post by: stemcider on July 17, 2014, 03:48:35 pm
Are 18xx games soloable at all?


Title: Re: 18xx for newbies
Post by: KevinR on July 17, 2014, 03:58:37 pm
Are 18xx games soloable at all?

Enrico has at least a couple reviews, so they're at least that soloable.


Title: Re: 18xx for newbies
Post by: Calandale on July 17, 2014, 04:22:56 pm
I find them very much so. You can even sketch out general strategies in
them pretty easily - sorta like written orders in a wargame.


Title: Re: 18xx for newbies
Post by: stemcider on July 17, 2014, 04:24:40 pm
Good to know. I've been interested for a while now. I'll try to grab one for cheap next time I see it.

I might even be able to get my girlfriend to play with me. She really likes Silverton.


Title: Re: 18xx for newbies
Post by: Calandale on July 17, 2014, 04:26:51 pm
18AL and 18GA are available for free PnP.

I made really crappy copies of both without much effort.
Good way to test out whether you like. They're not the best games,
but they're fairly solid representatives of the 1830 branch of the family.


Title: Re: 18xx for newbies
Post by: egg_salad on July 17, 2014, 07:36:59 pm
18OE!

(I assume this is like posting Case Blue in a wargame discussion)


Title: Re: 18xx for newbies
Post by: Calandale on July 17, 2014, 07:46:45 pm
I've not heard anything but size to really make that one (or C2C) stand out.


Title: Re: 18xx for newbies
Post by: egg_salad on July 17, 2014, 07:52:03 pm
I've not heard anything but size to really make that one (or C2C) stand out.

And you feel size matters not?


Title: Re: 18xx for newbies
Post by: Calandale on July 17, 2014, 07:57:12 pm
It matters some. Being able to see a whole continent's rail net grow is interesting.

Not sure it makes much difference from a gameplay stance though.


Title: Re: 18xx for newbies
Post by: weateallthepies on July 22, 2014, 03:39:24 am
Is 1830 a good place to start? It's the one that I see for a reasonable price most regularly.

I'd like to think I could get someone to play it, but it's probably going to be a solo venture at least until I'm happy to teach it.


Title: Re: 18xx for newbies
Post by: Calandale on July 22, 2014, 04:01:17 am
We opened it up at a gaming club and just started playing. Probably got a bit wrong,
but it was a very good experience.

Make sure if it's the new edition that it has the original short game though. That's a
treasure I wouldn't want to do without.


Title: Re: 18xx for newbies
Post by: egg_salad on July 22, 2014, 06:25:04 pm
Is 1830 a good place to start? It's the one that I see for a reasonable price most regularly.

I'd like to think I could get someone to play it, but it's probably going to be a solo venture at least until I'm happy to teach it.

I was eased into 18xx by an experienced partner.  He feels strongly that 1825/29 (which have a less predatory stock market) are the best games to start with.  Of course, they are expensive and hard to find.

After he started me on these, I bought 1830 off of Ebay and played it with my son.  It was fun.  Neither of us knew enough to make it really ugly, but my son was definitely getting the idea (and he beat me, of course).  For a group of all newbies, I think 1830 is a fine place to start.


Title: Re: 18xx for newbies
Post by: Calandale on July 22, 2014, 06:29:10 pm
I really disliked the '29 line of games. In part because of the less predatory market,
but also because the one I played was overly long and unbalanced. If I had seen
it first, I never would have played 'xx again, I suspect.

'35 is milder than most, but probably a little more enjoyable than the '29 designs.
I'm no big fan of it either though.


Title: Re: 18xx for newbies
Post by: egg_salad on July 22, 2014, 06:34:35 pm
I really disliked the '29 line of games. In part because of the less predatory market,
but also because the one I played was overly long and unbalanced. If I had seen
it first, I never would have played 'xx again, I suspect.

'35 is milder than most, but probably a little more enjoyable than the '29 designs.
I'm no big fan of it either though.
I like 1829 mainline more than 1829.  And I like 1829 Mainline quite a bit.  Have not experienced 1829 as unbalanced, but I am no expert.

I suppose I like a little randomness, which 1829 Mainline adds in with the card dealing mechanic..


Title: Re: 18xx for newbies
Post by: Calandale on July 22, 2014, 06:35:45 pm
'53 has a random card expansion. That's a really WEIRD one overall.


Title: Re: 18xx for newbies
Post by: weateallthepies on July 23, 2014, 03:50:21 am
OK going to keep an eye out for a cheap copy of the new version of 1830 I think. Cheers for the replies.

Has anyone played the old 1830 PC game? Have thought about getting a copy of that to give it a go too.


Title: Re: 18xx for newbies
Post by: Calandale on July 23, 2014, 08:53:42 am
OK going to keep an eye out for a cheap copy of the new version of 1830 I think. Cheers for the replies.


The new one is the one I'm not sure has the short game.

Quote
Has anyone played the old 1830 PC game? Have thought about getting a copy of that to give it a go too.

Yes. It does the rules well. The AI is terrible though. But it gives you a nice hotseat version of the game.



Title: Re: 18xx for newbies
Post by: weateallthepies on July 23, 2014, 12:26:01 pm
OK going to keep an eye out for a cheap copy of the new version of 1830 I think. Cheers for the replies.


The new one is the one I'm not sure has the short game.

Quote
Has anyone played the old 1830 PC game? Have thought about getting a copy of that to give it a go too.

Yes. It does the rules well. The AI is terrible though. But it gives you a nice hotseat version of the game.



Thanks, might grab the PC game.

Ah yes misread your original post, I'll check on the short game before I buy any.


Title: Re: 18xx for newbies
Post by: Calandale on July 23, 2014, 12:35:13 pm
I don't recall if the PC game supports it either. But hey, it's just abandonware.


Title: Re: 18xx for newbies
Post by: weateallthepies on July 23, 2014, 01:25:55 pm
I don't recall if the PC game supports it either. But hey, it's just abandonware.

Yeah just tried it in dosbox and it runs fine. Might see if I can get it working on the ipad.


Title: Re: 18xx for newbies
Post by: kwojtasz on July 25, 2014, 03:13:26 pm
http://rails.sourceforge.net/   is a good java 18xx online version.   Useful for multiple people playing over the internet, though no AI at this point.

Supports playing 1830, 18Kaas, 1889, 1856, 18AL, 1851, 18EU, 18TN, 18GA, 1835 and 1880, with more under development.


Title: Re: 18xx for newbies
Post by: Calandale on July 25, 2014, 04:37:36 pm
Might be the only way I get 'round to actually playing '41, if it gets an online implementation. :(