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The worst and overrated wargames?

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sparty
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« Reply #15 on: July 17, 2014, 08:02:49 pm »

I'll go with ASL because we're talking about overrated rather than whether a game is good or bad. 

ASL is a good game.  It is wildly overrated though.
No Retreat: The Russian Front.  Again, good game.  Overrated for the coronary people had over this thing.

Worst game?

U-Boat Leader is pretty terrible.  Sails of Glory was pretty lame.    Rebel Raiders on the High Seas with the rules as written is a math problem that has a solution which I detest.
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capt_s
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« Reply #16 on: July 17, 2014, 08:15:24 pm »

I found that the number of players has a significant influence for me. I liked it in 5 (solo), but it was completely ahistorical in three (opposed) .

You might be on to something there. Perhaps it needs more players (with their competing interests) to help it flow.

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It seems like there's a lot of people that don't like AVD.

I remember an early (?) discussion about AVD where folks were looking askance at the German armored units. Their defensive values I think.
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« Reply #17 on: July 17, 2014, 08:32:37 pm »


  For me the worst is the SCS game "Drive on Paris," covering the 1914 campaign in the West. Over here in Europe it caused some buzz when it was released.

  The game's exploitation rules coupled with the German forced march ability allows the German player to zip around northern France and are completely out of place for the time period. As the German I grouped my "special" exploitation capable German infantry with my cavalry to form fast mobile strike forces, which were fun to use, but performed more like Panzergruppen than foot soldiers.

  The "Emmich Assault Force" rule has no basis in reality at all. It is shown as a specially trained fortress attack group--that is not true. 

  What floors me is the high price this game still fetches (over $100).

   
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billyboy
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« Reply #18 on: July 17, 2014, 09:23:52 pm »

The Gamer's OCS series.

You're dead to me!

Actually, I look forward to your post explaining why you think this is so. Then you'll be dead to me.  Wink


Ditto
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Rockhopper
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« Reply #19 on: July 18, 2014, 09:39:00 am »

U-Boat Leader is pretty terrible. 

I couldn't think of anything that I considered bad, because I typically research the heck out of stuff, so I usually know what I am getting.

Gotta agree with you about U-Boat Leader though. I've been hooked on Hornet Leader, and pre-ordered UBL. I was very disappointed. So, +1.
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« Reply #20 on: July 19, 2014, 02:57:42 am »


  For me the worst is the SCS game "Drive on Paris," covering the 1914 campaign in the West. Over here in Europe it caused some buzz when it was released.

  The game's exploitation rules coupled with the German forced march ability allows the German player to zip around northern France and are completely out of place for the time period. As the German I grouped my "special" exploitation capable German infantry with my cavalry to form fast mobile strike forces, which were fun to use, but performed more like Panzergruppen than foot soldiers.

  The "Emmich Assault Force" rule has no basis in reality at all. It is shown as a specially trained fortress attack group--that is not true. 

  What floors me is the high price this game still fetches (over $100).

 What I noticed about this game right off the bat was most of the infantry units were identical regardless of nationality. The French could only wish that their units were as good as the Germans or the British. Comparing the OOB of DoP with the OOB of March To Victory is very revealing. DoP is basically setup to give the French an unhistorical shot at victory.

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Mike Dorrish
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« Reply #21 on: July 19, 2014, 06:39:17 am »

I will mention something positive about PoG.

I doubt I have felt such angst playing a game as I did with this one. The tension derived from the 6 cards max allowed per turn will eat at you. Eat ... at ..... you. Which is true for any game I have played that employs this mechanic as a matter of fact.

I understand the arguments against re: simulation, card decision impact, supply and whatnot. All of which push PoG slightly more towards the "GAME" side of the sliding GAME vs SIMULATION scale in my mind.

I don't care .... I have fun playing it. And that is what is important to me.    Tongue 

Side Note: Here I am coming to the defense of a game I have played all of three times .... LOL!

Merely a good "game". Should be listed with Sorry, Clue, and Monopoly
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The Grinch
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« Reply #22 on: July 19, 2014, 10:13:41 am »


Chess.  Definitely overrated as a simulation; possibly worst.

Actually, chess in its original form (chaturanga) was a fair simulation of warfare in ancient India, with the setup based on an actual military formation.

The only "wargame" I recall actually hating on first play is Test of Fire: Bull Run.  I think the roll-to-move mechanism belongs in some Milton Bradley game from 50 years ago or in some family game, not in a contemporary wargame.  Yet people seem to love is as a quick intro-level game.  I'm glad it wasn't my first exposure to wargames.
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« Reply #23 on: July 19, 2014, 10:50:33 am »

For overrated I think I'd throw in The Hunters.  I played it for an hour or two soon after receiving it and it really doesn't have that many more decision points than B-17, which seemed to be it's big promise.
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Paul
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« Reply #24 on: July 19, 2014, 11:12:48 pm »

Quote
What I noticed about this game right off the bat was most of the infantry units were identical regardless of nationality. The French could only wish that their units were as good as the Germans or the British. Comparing the OOB of DoP with the OOB of March To Victory is very revealing. DoP is basically setup to give the French an unhistorical shot at victory.

  The units do a have a vanilla look to them across the nationalities, with one big exception--the ability of some of the German units to exploit and force march. Giving only a small set of units the ability to force march was a red flag right away. The British and French did a lot of hard marching as well during the campaign. My impression is that a lot of special factors had to be applied to get something of a historical result.
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